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Richard Fuisz Profile
Richard Fuisz

@richardfuisz

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Asking biotechnology (politely) to do useful things. | Future House, Arcadia Science, Templa Nucleics.

San Francisco, CA
Joined August 2015
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
Every mutation that could exist, does exist. That has only been true for ~200 years. Most beneficial variants just haven't had the time to become ubiquitous. But now, at least 50 people in the world have every possible mutation in the human genome.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
90% of all candidate gene research done in 2007 is garbage, the original authors in 2022 went back and now say RIMS1 doesn’t make you blind:
@getnormality
normality
5 months
jesus christ
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
@micsolana At what point does the narrative switch from “Tech workers, GTFO” to “Tech workers abandoned SF in its hour of need!”
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@NickParkerPrint mutations that kill you in the womb are fairly common, but because they end in miscarriage, no one shows up in clinic with them. So if you never see a mutation, you can infer that it is probably quite bad:
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
link to the original paper for those reading along at home
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@BorisBartlog Yeah. So not literally *every mutation*. But SNVs are still disproportionately interesting, so >99% SNV coverage is still a big deal IMO. There was some good comments on indels too
@iskander
alex rubinsteyn
5 months
@richardfuisz This is very SNV centric I suspect long reads and improved visibility of indels and SVs will dislodge this paradigm of thinking
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
I agree with this prediction, but I think it gets causality backwards. The curve of moores law was carefully choreographed between visionary buyers and fiercely competitive providers — the big use cases of today (streaming video, AI) were easily articulated in the 1960’s, and
@AlfredoAndere
Alfredo Andere
3 months
Over the next two decades sequencing DNA and proteins will become practically free. The implications of that are impossibly hard to grasp and reason about, but they will be wild.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 months
new baker lab banger dropped:
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@DanielleFong Yes, but combined effects are mostly overrated. Most mutations are additive.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
@Austen Manufacturing ramp up was slow, we needed time for that to run in parallel to trials. We also needed some long term data. mRNA vaccines are unproven tech, where unproven *could have* meant “gives everyone Leukemia 6 mo after injection”.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
90% of all candidate gene research done in 2007 is garbage, the original authors in 2022 went back and now say RIMS1 doesn’t make you blind:
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
Lots of biotechs get uneasy about paying 3X to a software engineer vs an equivalently talented biologist, and managing the culture clash between tech / bio. So lots of bright comp-bio folks quite happily sold out and went to big tech. If that’s changing, it would be great.
@nlarusstone
Nicholas Larus-Stone
2 years
This is a great point about software in biotech — where is the open source??? I think a lot of this is a combination of biotechs: - Not caring about software - Having a few engineers - Believing their entire problem space is unique Much of this is changing
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@iskander very SNV centric! the number of possible indels is just so much higher, we probably haven't saturated yet. But in ORFs most indels are LoF -- i think you'd expect SNVs to be a bit more interesting than an indel, ceteris paribus.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@AlecStapp changing your menu now doesn't give you the exemption -- you needed to have started bread production ~2 weeks before the bill was signed.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
@Noahpinion the translation in the quoted tweet is very bad -- this new policy requires both parental & child consent for euthanasia in cases with "unbearable suffering". Only when the child is unable to consent (e.g. on life support) then parents & doctor are allowed to act w/o consent.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@BobCameraman no. in order of likelihood: 1. Mutation does nothing 2. Mutation makes you a little less healthy -- increases risk of Crohn's disease by 10% or something 3. Mutation kills you in the womb 4. Mutation makes you way less healthy 5. mutation makes you a bit healthier (rare!)
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
This week on how the impregnable security of using of company letterhead will stop the next wave of rogue CRISPR baby hackers
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@DanielleFong You see non-linearities in heterozygotes -> homozygotes for rare alleles sometimes, but nonlinearities from different genes (having mutations A,B,C produces effect very different than the sum of effects A,B,C) is less common (still happens sometimes!)
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
@ThatElJefe Buzzfeed: the fifth estate
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@NeolibHotTakes The paper only addressed the blind part, not the wizard part…. So you can still keep the dream alive
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@eshear @getnormality @literalbanana Doesn’t make you blind; might make you smart. It’s 1:5000, so it should be possible to find a lot more people to study.
@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
90% of all candidate gene research done in 2007 is garbage, the original authors in 2022 went back and now say RIMS1 doesn’t make you blind:
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
7 months
@NickADobos @venturetwins I’ve always thought the double picture requirement on IDs was useless. But it actually makes this into a fairly obvious fake!
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
Some data in flies. RIMS1 is implicated in autism. But it’s all a bit speculative until someone does a more thorough study imo.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
A lot of the converted warehouse office space (high ceilings, good power, simple layout, soma/dog patch zoning) can be converted to lab space — and that’s happening pretty fast.
@typesfast
Ryan Petersen
2 years
San Francisco has about 28% of its total office inventory on the market for lease or sublease.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 months
All drugs (recreational, medical, etc) should be legal for anyone over 90 years old
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
At 23&me’s current market cap, you could buy 14M people’s worth of SNP-chip data for ~$20/person. That’s a nice discount. UKBB has only 500k people in it. Can the USA nationalize 23&Me, collect health data from epic for all consenting former customers, and leapfrog UKBB?
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
Any longevity drug that doesn't address Alzheimers isn't a serious strategy for living to 100.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
do you take credit for ideas you have in your dreams?
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
@Austen If we really get a vaccine out in 11 months, that is staggeringly fast.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@cremieuxrecueil Is this just insufficient supply of insulin / statins? Isn’t the obesity rate much lower in Sudan than the USA?
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
the whole field of genetics was done in the wrong order. should've developed NGS before human genome project, should've built big biobanks before spending all that time on candidate genes....
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 months
About to leak some serious alpha here: SF has only 1 DMV location. It can be a few hour wait if you’re unlucky. But nopalito across the street has the best Mexican food I’ve ever had, and no one minds if you grab a number, eat, and come back an hour or 2 later.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
8 months
❤️
@SGRodriques
Sam Rodriques
8 months
In the run up to Thanksgiving, I want to take a moment to emphasize my deep appreciation for @richardfuisz , who played an integral role in getting Future House off the ground. 1/n
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
Arcadia’s new art is pretty slick. Also a nice definition of this whole non-model organism thing.
@ArcadiaScience
Arcadia Science
2 years
📣Big news day!📣 We've got a new website!! Check it out and let us know which piece of #sciart is your favorite! Also, read our new blog post, answering the question: “So if you aren’t studying model organisms, which organisms will you be studying?”
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
8 months
@methylrot @lpachter Happy to elaborate, but this is a long tweet, be careful what you ask for... First off, Orchid offers some very nice monogenic offerings that other providers don't offer. the polygenic scores are just one small part of the overall service. It seems weird to fixate on that one
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@DCLocalDesign @NickParkerPrint see above, all SNV mutations that can happen, have happened.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
If true, this is a very, very big moment.
@antonioregalado
Antonio Regalado
6 years
BREAKING: Chinese scientists making CRISPR babies
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
getting more into the habit of writing this year -- here are some thoughts on iteration cycles in biology
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
Xerox PARC, but for FACS Machines
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 years
@Jason Yeah - what if someone could route a pipe right to my house? Maybe into each of the rooms where I regularly need water? Capex probably really high. You’d get a local monopoly, though, especially if you could encourage a second industry of appliances that used piped in water...
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
7 months
@mnovendstern not entirely clear that IQ models or other polygenic models still hold as well in the very far right tails where data is sparse? Super high iq might be rare variants too that don’t show up in snp arrays. A combo multi-PRS seems a better selection criteria
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 years
Seeking ideas, feedback, and "peer review" on Arcadia -- what can we do to improve the Arcadia experiment?
@seemaychou
seemay chou
3 years
Today @dkthomp sparks an important dialogue about fueling scientific progress. Looking forward to a larger convo w the scientific community on how @arcadiascience could help enable more - more science, more utility, more ideas. And important for me personally - more people. 1/4
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
People should talk more about Henry Wallace. He started one of the first serious ag-tech companies, was a serious occultist, kicked-off the research into hybrid corn that hired borlaug, was FDR's VP in WW2, and supported desegregation and equality before it was cool.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
Lots of people still haven’t had first-hand experience with LLM interfaces for doing scientific tasks. If you have 5 minutes right now, it’s worth fiddling with this and thinking about how a tool like this might be built to support the sort of tasks you do. Would love DMs /
@DeepOriginBio
Deep Origin
3 months
We're thrilled to announce Balto, the world's first AI assistant for drug discovery! Balto provides viable hits for drug discovery programs faster, more accurately, and easier than ever before. It's as simple as a conversation. Sign up today 👇
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@andy_matuschak Guitars have many positions to play the same note — where you play the first note can change based on where your hand needs to be for the next note. Tabs include that info, while classic notation does not. Tabs also sometimes include more dynamics, slides & bends. IME traditional
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
@4LOVofScience Bio-twitter right now
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@xenodochial05f6 We only have whole genome sequencing & any type of decent phenotyping for 0.01% of the human population at this point… so there isn’t good statistical power to evaluate lots of these mutations. But sequencing costs are falling, and open datasets are growing, so trending positive
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
9 months
Totally floored by how smooth the @Waymo cars are — I can work on a laptop w/o feeling carsick. Game changer. Feels like the future!
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 months
Classic example of candidate gene BS -- the only study i know of that shows NPSR1 was based on 2 short sleepers in a family that shared the mutation, and some loosely suggestive mousework. Doesn't validate in UKBB afaik.
@KianSadeghi5
Kian Sadeghi
4 months
GENE: NPSR1 GENOTYPE: Y206H/+ ABILITY: HIGH-PERFORMING ON LOW SLEEP Four hours of sleep? Forget about it. Your @eightsleep score would 😱😱😱😱 Not for people with rare variants in their NPSR1 gene, who thrive on as little as 4 hours of sleep a night — sometimes even in
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
@antonioregalado In short though, @catalogdna transformed DNA data storage from a synthesis chemistry problem (hard) into a liquid handling problem (easier). So they are future-proofed against new synthesis technologies, and can focus on hardware.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 years
@kimmaicutler @Bob_Wachter @UCSF @cziscience The 95% is referencing high viral load omicron cases — ct <30. cases where someone is most contagious.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
7 months
@ruth_hook_ There’s this weird thing where undergrad selectiveness determines the popular reputation. Rockefeller should very publicly admit the single best applicant in each state or something to some weird pseudo undergrad program and it would fix this
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@DCLocalDesign @NickParkerPrint these are the kind of big questions we need to be asking ourselves.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
@Lan_Dao_ This but for everything, not just having kids. Do the things you care about as soon as they make sense for you.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 months
LRP5 G171V carriers also get very, very big jaws & bone growths on the roof of their mouth that can interfere with speech -- I'm not sure this one is a slam dunk unless you expect to have routine exposure to high speed collisions.
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@KianSadeghi5
Kian Sadeghi
4 months
GENE: LRP5 GENOTYPE: G171V/+ ABILITY: UNBREAKABLE BONES In 1994, a man walked away from a serious car accident without any broken bones. How? It turns out he had bones that were EIGHT TIMES denser than a typical person's due to a rare genetic variant in his LRP5 gene.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 months
A big part of America’s egalitarian spirit is that we’ve always had a pretty high cost of labor, compared to most other places. Certainly a mixed blessing — but it explains a lot of USA-specific oddities once you start looking out for it.
@mattyglesias
Matthew Yglesias
2 months
A Singaporean acquaintance’s take on America: We benefit from dramatically bigger houses but then squander it by not filling the square footage with low-paid guest worker live-in nannies and maids. (Real ideological dead zone in US politics)
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
@antonioregalado ~98% of the cost of DNA data storage is in the synthesis of DNA- it’s also the biggest throughput bottleneck. Catalog’s method essentially avoids synthesis Catalog’s method is trying to replace magnetic tape, not flash drives - so cost and throughput will win the day.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
Tech Bros will spend $3k for VR headsets but won't spend $500 to reduce their kid's risk of chromosomal abnormalities by 30%
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@the_megabase my ~50 people have each is purely off of de novos though, so an unreasonably conservative low-end estimate.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
9 months
@shelbynewsad Look at Twist’s finances. The cost of synthesizing DNA doesn’t kill them, but sales costs, G&A, etc are killer. Nearly ever synthesis co ever founded has lost money. For most companies, a 50% reduction in prices wouldn’t change behavior much. Prices have flattened out because
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@balajis Gene addressed this a bit in the comments: 1. Delivery to the brain is super hard, SOTA afaik is 10% efficiency, with uneven expression levels. We don’t know what phenotype you get at 10% expression post-adulthood. It’s not obvious how you would test that, since mice will make
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
If you have big ideas, & need money, talk to Tom. If you have money you want to convert into big ideas, also talk to Tom!
@tkalil2050
Thomas Kalil
3 months
I am excited to announce the launch of Renaissance Philanthropy, with a phenomenal team including @KumarAGarg . Our goal is to help foundations and philanthropists promote a 21st century renaissance, fueled by advances in science, technology and innovation.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
Not all rare variants are useless or do more harm than good -- most beneficial rare variants just haven't had time to propagate. The human population exploded recently, and that makes human genetics kind of weird:
@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
Every mutation that could exist, does exist. That has only been true for ~200 years. Most beneficial variants just haven't had the time to become ubiquitous. But now, at least 50 people in the world have every possible mutation in the human genome.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
Once again, New Science publishes something very much worth reading -- hat tip to @RogersBacon1
@newscienceorg
New Science
2 years
For 350 years, scientists have been urged to "reject all the amplifications, digressions, and swellings of style." But have we gone too far? A brief history of science writing & style.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@the_megabase yeah it turns out it was a bad method. But it was the standard method at the time, and people tolerated a high false discovery rate. I think the impressive thing now is the ease with which we can disprove these theories only ~15 years later
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
8 months
*Ehem*, *ehem* Cool work coming out of FH. Substantially outperforms Elicit, Perplexity, et al. Matches human performance!
@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
8 months
Sifting through 200k papers for GWAS hits, interpreting figures, and updating figures. Of course this isn’t unique to Gemini — gpt4 does this too. IMO the job description of “scientist” in 20 years will probably involve writing a lot of workflows like this to parse existing data,
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
….. in >150 years. There’s a strain of modern pronatalism that is basically the inverse of 1970’s “Population Bomb” fanatics — both are inexplicably reckless about extrapolating current trends out for over a century. Elon is demonstrably very good at this in other domains…
@elonmusk
Elon Musk
5 months
Japan will disappear if something doesn’t change
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
9 months
@typedfemale It’s a superfund site, that’s why the buildings around it are all empty
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 years
I was lucky to try this early, and it’s awesome. 100% would recommend.
@OrchidInc
Orchid
3 years
We believe every couple that wants to conceive, should be able to do so confidently. Announcing Orchid, a first-of-its-kind, ultra high resolution genetic testing system for couples.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@DCLocalDesign @NickParkerPrint i'm sorry, i was being sarcastic. there probably isn't a SNP that gives you gills.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
Intuition pump -- all chemicals have a dose that will kill a tumor, and another dose that will kill the patient. "Oncology drugs", crudely speaking, are the subclass of chemicals that kill tumor at a lower concentration than they kill the patient. What are the best ways we
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
Activating/inactivating proteins with magnets is easily top 5 coolest results from 2023. Super interesting for drug delivery.
@TanFad
Tanner Fadero
6 months
@RhoPower @millsjc67 @Maria_Ingaramo @AndrewGYork Much wilder idea: potentially there's magnetosensitive autofluorescence at/near mitochondria? @Maria_Ingaramo showed that flavins are necessary to confer magnetosensation in FPs. Try holding a powerful magnet next to your sample to kill the fluorescence?
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
Yikes
@NEJM
NEJM
5 months
Patients with evidence of microplastics and nanoplastics in carotid artery plaque, as compared with patients without, had a greater risk of adverse cardiovascular events at 34 months of follow-up. Read the full article:
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
9 months
@shelbynewsad If a company sold genome scale synthesis (or even chromosome scale synthesis) — which companies would buy it? How would they use it? Current co’s struggle to control variable and engineer at the scale of single proteins — chromosome-scale de novo engineering doesn’t seem worth it
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 years
@SynBioBeta For a nomination with a long history, Issac asimov’s “subcellular engineers” (aka synthetic biologists...) circa 1962!
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
2 years
The size of my grandfather’s (clearly prosthetic) head is extraordinary. Amazing.
@hulu
Hulu
2 years
How did a Stanford dropout become one of Silicon Valley's most notorious CEOs? @AmandaSeyfried stars as Theranos founder Elizabeth Holmes when #TheDropoutHulu premieres March 3. 🩸
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
7 months
Today's award for the most subversively genius marketing goes to Chevrolet of Watsonville
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
5 months
@Jvel10 @12josdic @getnormality I don't think that's actually true? There are definitely some very real "great tradeoff" or "no tradeoff" rare variants in the population. Its also not obvious that a 20 point IQ gain is actually strongly selected for.
@SashaGusevPosts
Sasha Gusev
5 months
@the_megabase What's the reasoning for why large positive effects on IQ need to be balanced by a negative effect? Seems like there's some broken telephone here if you follow the links.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
The -80C’s are coming.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 months
TIL that the word "antiparasitic" fails a spellchecker. If you somehow could tell that to a caveman, would they be more excited about the spellcheck, or would they be excited about the idea that, in 2024, you might not even need the word "antiparasitic"?
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
7 months
@gwern I tend to use "epigenetics is how cells 'dog ear' & highlight the pages of the book that is your genome' -- in the same way that your eye / hand might first turn to a well dogeared / highlighted section of an old (and those pages might be passed down over generations in that dog
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
@4LOVofScience Ehh, it’s a CW-style teen drama first and foremost with some science thrown in. I skipped around it a bit, a few funny moments (making fun of one character who installs magnets in their fingers) and some almost-real science (GMO-mosquitoes, Huntington’s gene therapy).
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
"Club Penguin is the Future of Digital Conferences" -- A Prescient Millenial, 2007 #SynBioBeta2020
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
6 years
Yes, that’s a coyote using a crosswalk in SF.
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
8 months
Sifting through 200k papers for GWAS hits, interpreting figures, and updating figures. Of course this isn’t unique to Gemini — gpt4 does this too. IMO the job description of “scientist” in 20 years will probably involve writing a lot of workflows like this to parse existing data,
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
It’s like having an undergrad intern who types much faster than you, works for peanuts, and occasionally knows how to do a few things that you’d have to google first to do yourself. So, a lot like having a real undergrad intern!
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
3 months
Some very good comments in this thread. One theme across the areas I'm most optimistic about is single cell sequencing -- imo patient WGS is already very in-bounds at current $200 price point (bigger bottleneck is on analysis time) -- but there are plenty of diagnostic
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@richardfuisz
Richard Fuisz
4 years
@balajis Longitude-centric world probably favors Eurasia — especially Africa/Europe combo, given African population trajectory and broad range of salary expectations. India & China obviously have a lot of people. America’s span effectively 5 zones — NA and SA are surprisingly spread out.
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Richard Fuisz
2 years
@celinehalioua My hot take is that if gsheets can't do the job, you shouldn't be using spreadsheets at all...
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Richard Fuisz
2 years
@Ben_Reinhardt +1 preorder on a coffee table book of this.
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Richard Fuisz
3 months
@LNuzhna would love to attend!
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Richard Fuisz
1 year
@Jess_Riedel @HSPAbWGI @ESYudkowsky What i want to know: for the "1/6 patients who are rationing their insulin," how many of them are getting prescribed the expensive stuff but unaware / unable to get a rx for the cheaper stuff? Surely the benefit of the tweaks don't outweigh the risks of witholding use.
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Richard Fuisz
3 years
@pdhsu @Eppendorf_USA Rainin LTS are nice and the pipette tip shortages appear to be easing, I can send you some links that worked for us to get shipments
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Richard Fuisz
2 years
It's weird when a social movement started around some random online forums you read in middle school is now something that serious people are supposed to have serious takes on.
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Richard Fuisz
6 years
“data or it didn’t happen”. But, if it did happen, lulu & nana feel like a real moment. Mankind just took direct editing privileges over the gene pool. And that decision was made near-unilaterally and secretively in Shenzhen. It’s gonna get weird.
@Aiims1742
Anirban Maitra
6 years
@EricTopol @antonioregalado @lisamjarvis @emilylmullin @AP Here’s a @YouTube video by Dr. He announcing the birth. Twins Lulu and Nana are home. Unbelievable!
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Richard Fuisz
3 years
@mualphaxi @WillManidis A mask folds into your pocket neatly when you arrive, a helmet is clunky. That was the big thing I remember from my (frequently helmet-free) Stanford biking. The real q - what percentage we’re riding with their hands off the handlebars or carrying something heavy simultaneously?
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Richard Fuisz
1 year
Most book reviews are actually book reports — but if we called them “book reports” no one would read them.
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Richard Fuisz
4 years
@4LOVofScience I think I now understand why programmers pull their hair out when they watch mr robot etc.
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