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Untold Fortune

@UntoldFortune

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Theology and Philosophy nut returning to Plato and eastern Patristics. My daily twitter activity is penance for a decade spent as the most decadent Thomist. ☦️

Joined November 2023
Don't wanna be here? Send us removal request.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
22 days
Sometimes Patristic epithets are just next level. I was curious to see just how far I could get writing a paragraph doing nothing but stringing epithets about one particular person together. I think it turned out pretty decent. ----- The bishop of the Arians- that wretched
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@UntoldFortune
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5 months
@ShitpostGate I know this is supposed to be like a “omg Trump got owned” sorta thing, but I have met exactly two women in my entire life who owned alienware computers. As it so happens, those same women were the most terrifyingly competent human beings I had ever seen.
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Never thought I’d see the day Rome converted to Eastern Orthodoxy, but here we are.
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4 months
@focusfronting If I had a Plato fetish and also had a secret affair I wanted to keep under wraps, “platonically” is a hell of a word to kill two birds with one stone.
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5 months
@ShitpostGate Ok ok, you guys got me: its technically not alienware. But like I made a goofy joke off a life experience with two women gamers. Please dont pile on all this misogyny for a girl doing her 9-5.
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2 months
Roman Catholic apologist leaves Twitter in hours after realizing his Church was the foundation of modern views on abortion.
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@Scholastic_X I have to admit I was really excited to witness a Thomist discuss Scripture and Patristics. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting to witness it.
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"Catholic ecumenists, I should point out, often misconstrue the nature of the Orthodox distrust of their good will. It is not simply the case that the Orthodox are so fissiparous and jealous of their autonomy that the Petrine office appears to them a dangerous principle of
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I dont often wish to agree with Taylor Marshall, but I’ve followed this story for some time, and he’s absolutely correct on this one. There is no reasonable explanation Rupnik’s artwork still adorns the Vatican after so many credible allegations have been made, the man was cast
@TaylorRMarshall
Dr Taylor Marshall™️
@TaylorRMarshall
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Pope Francis notified, put on trial, and excommunicated Abp. Vigano in less than 30 days. But the nun-raping artist Fr Rupnik SJ gets years of tolerance and his art commissioned for Vatican projects even as of Aug 15 2024. It's all you need to know about the perversty of the
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The Filioque from the Perspectives of Gregory of Nyssa and the Council of Blachernae (1285) summarized in the absolute, clearest form in which I can possibly express it.
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2 months
Ever wondered what caused Roman Catholicism to betray the sanctity of life to the point that the Ecumenical Council of Vienne dogmatically hereticized theologians who believed life began at conception? Or why- when abortifacient usage was so horrendously widespread- God sent
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2 months
Hint hint: Not even his own Church believes what he believes. Or they could never have justified lifting the excommunication from the start. Or letting Eastern Rite Catholics off the hook on the Creed. Or bishops (and Francis, I've read) widely withdrawing the condemnation of
@thomisticae
Fanatic Thomist 🇻🇦
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2 months
@CatholicDwong Without the Filioque, Christianity is false.
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1 month
@Scholastic_X Of all the woman to complain about on twitter, you picked this one.
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1 month
For anyone even remotely interested in the Filioque, I sincerely hope you'll consider reading this summary. It is- in my view- that simplest and clearest summary possible of the eastern position that is also substantiated by what I regard to be some of the most explicit
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2 months
This is from St. Maximus's letter to Marinus of Cyprus, and it is- so far as I am aware- the absolute earliest evidence of dispute about the Filioque. What does it tell us? -The terminological issue of ekpouresis v proenai was identified immediately. -The West- and certainly
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Alright, I'm not a Filioque specialist. It just so happened Erick picked the exact wrong passage of Augustine, so I did my thing. And now everyone's messaging me asking me to talk about the Filioque. When mostly I just enjoy exegeting Patristics. Nevertheless, sometimes people do
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@redeemed_zoomer On the bright side, you can’t commit the Filioque heresy if you dont recite the Creed.
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1 month
The proper understanding of original sin.
@GnomeRad
Conrad (WWIII⚡️Analyst)
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1 month
“We baptize even infants, though they are not defiled by sins, so that there may be given to them holiness, righteousness, adoption, inheritance, brotherhood with Christ, and that they may be His members.” -St. John Chrysostom ☦️
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@FischerKing64 Weird that she is comfortable using terminology like “Metabolic rift” “Disruption of energy circuits” “Historicist ideological critiques of the Romantic imagination” … But she struggled to express the sentence, “we want food”
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2 months
Unbelievably fascinating. Anyone with basic history under their belt has some passing familiarity with the character of Mark of Ephesus. But the story of his presence at the Council of Florence is just extraordinary. First, he appeals to Dun Scotus's interpretation of Gregory
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2 months
The fact Augustine is most commonly cited as a proof for the Filioque blows my mind. He is literally THIS explicit in Book 15, Chapter 17 of his De Trinitate: "And yet it is not to no purpose that in this Trinity the Son and none other is called the Word of God, and the Holy
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25 days
DM’s like this remind me that my vocation is an altogether strange-but-important one. In truth, I’d be altogether less inclined to give Catholics a hard time if it werent for the fact the loudest of them tend to be Thomists.
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Actual Catholic treatment of a Catholic that dares to criticize Thomas in passing. Couldnt make this up if I tried.
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"Therefore, heap up all the quotations of Augustine you wish, you four, and find in them an answer that satisfies not only my mind but my soul, and I shall then embrace your Augustinism and its filioque and all its 'mysterious predestination to damnation for the greater glory of
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I'm going to let you in on a tricky Catholic secret that only a few of us understand well. Technically there is no *canonical* list of ecumenical councils and papal succession. This is how- for example- Pope Theodore believed so strongly that Lateran 649 was ecumenical even
@RockwellGarry
Камчатка
@RockwellGarry
24 days
Which has higher authority will differ (unless you've a gift for ineffable nuance) depending on which authoritative statement you consult. Namely, the Council of Constance or Vatican I.
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@Scholastic_X This is so ridiculous that you actually come off as a self parody. Yeah, shes married. So what? Its normal for a girl her age to lean on their looks for followers, and everyone starts their journey at different places. The pictures are tasteful and shes a simple reminder that
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3 months
@langluigi_ The concessions are literally thing I never thought I’d see in multiple lifetimes, let alone one.
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3 months
Never thought I’d see the day Rome converted to Eastern Orthodoxy, but here we are.
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Pointing out Thomas is a material heretic even by Rome's own standard always get them going.
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Absolutely unhinged. As ugly as it is, people need to see Thomism for what it is. In precisely the way I wish I had seen far sooner than I did.
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1 month
Actual Catholic treatment of a Catholic that dares to criticize Thomas in passing. Couldnt make this up if I tried.
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2 months
Warning: this is not a meme. Its a very boring- nearly academic- analysis of Augustine's view on the procession of the Spirit in relation to the Filioque. Nevertheless, some of you might find value in it.
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2 months
This is a revised and updated selection of resources for the Filioque. St. Basil deserves a page, and Maximos deserves an analysis in full, so I'll update these things slowly over time. I've included my analysis of Augustine, but if you're the sort of person to read it at all,
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Please keep me sending me material for my "Things Catholic Trads Actually Said" folder. The results so far are just incredible.
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@Scholastic_X @CatholicDwong Then why do your own bishops deny this?
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1 month
Comparing the severity of various sins in Western Christianity of the 7th century. [Edit: updated for the utmost accuracy and clarity on the term "strange".]
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Catholics are literally insecure that Jonathan Edwards out-hellfire'd them.
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2 months
Make your own judgment on this one, guys.
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2 months
Alright, somebody needs to call this type of strawman out, so here we are. Neither Eastern Orthodox believe nor did any early Patristics (afaik) ever believe that the existence of divine person precedes their essence in the hypostastic procession. In fact, not even Scholarius
@thomisticae
Fanatic Thomist 🇻🇦
@thomisticae
2 months
Secondly, it posits an impossibility: For how can a person be produced and exist while being logically prior to receiving His essence? That'd mean a person is produced and exists without His essence, since His hypostatic origin is logically prior to communication of essence. 5/6
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@UntoldFortune
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1 month
Astounding. From Bradshaw's Aristotle: East and West- Aquinas pretends to Dionysius while completely subverting him. He then misreads Damascene entirely.
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@UntoldFortune
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Updated resources by which to learn how Roman Catholicism betrayed the Christian faith and the sanctity of life by condemning those who believed life began at conception. Thomism is a monstrous, abominable metaphysics.
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@UntoldFortune
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I make stuff like this more for my own sake than yours, but if this is useful to you, have it. The translations of Augustine's Latin are my own because I got tired of papists bullshitting me.
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@btbsoco lmao. this is such cope I cant even.
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1 month
Alright. This is Aquinas's absolute last hope. Either they prove the case of continuity, or I will never read anything by Aquinas ever again.
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1 month
@Scholastic_X You want to know why I give Aquinas a hard time? Here. I’ll even send you a free copy of my book once I’m done. On the house.
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1 month
@ByzantineBound @B_Goodness Lets put it this way: I was quite devoted to the pro life movement when I was Roman Catholic and read Thomas in the Latin beginning in high school. After an Ivy League education with extensive philosophy and theology, I revisited him and saw just how thoroughly he fell for the
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2 months
Solid rant. 10/10.
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2 months
Thomist becomes crybaby when he gets the clearest of all opportunities to defend the Angelic Doctor.
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"Vigilius didn't intend to speak infallibly"
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1 month
Why, I wonder, would anyone possibly feel anxious?
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@SecretFire79
🔥☩JMT☩🔥
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1 month
“Anxiety is the greatest evil that can befall a soul except sin. God commands you to pray, but He forbids you to worry.” - Saint Francis de Sales🇻🇦🕊️
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@Philosophymeme0 A bit unfair to Wittgenstein. He felt terribly about his severity and literally sought the children out to issue public apologies years later.
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1 month
In some ways, I enjoy posts like this for the comments alone. In the same way that you cant help but chuckle at the top comments of a youtube video. Now, Fanatic Thomist is the sort of e-Thomist who writes self-aware propaganda under the guise of continuity with "Thomism" writ
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@thomisticae
Fanatic Thomist 🇻🇦
@thomisticae
1 month
🧵 Eastern "Orthodoxy" is the modern-day Pelagianism heresy! The Eastern "Orthodox Church" officially anathematized the Gospel of Jesus Christ and taught Pelagian heresy in 1672 Council of Jerusalem under Patriarch Dositheus of Jerusalem.
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2 months
Sometimes its like shooting fish in a barrel. Maybe both sides should stop trying to prove the faith through miracles that may or may not have happened as depicted. Who knows. No allegations. They’re just not useful as arguments imo.
@langluigi_
luigi
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@GnomeRad Latins:
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1 month
Reminder: Thomistic metaphysics leads Thomists to DESPISE women, and they have indeed despised them throughout all of history. What woman did they despise the most? None other than the Blessed Mother of God.
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Augustine: We can say the Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son, but we need to be careful to point out that it proceeds from each in different ways. Otherwise, what we call "procession" would simply be a type of begetting of a "Second Son" by two parents instead of
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A reminder that I really ought to post once a day at least in my boundless ecumenical charity. In the 13th century, Rome banned classroom study of Aristotle's De Anima, Metaphysics, and Physics beginning with Pope Gregory IX. The prohibition was renewed indefinitely thereafter
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@MattRob78281471
Plato's Stepchild
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"The Papal prohibitions which had sought to ban from the universities all of Aristotle's treatises on subjects other than logic, had been defied." - Georges Duby
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2 months
Some simple resources for the perennial Filioque argument, including Thomas's silly treatment of it. The man literally pretended to critique matters of which he had: a) No knowledge of Greek. Imagine claiming "any origin whatsoever" applied to the "ekpouresis" of John 15:26,
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3 months
Reminder to Catholics: The Tridentine Rite was imposed by fiat around 1570 in a manner *far* more extreme and dramatic than anything Francis has done. It was also *highly* controversial in its day for its many, many modernist deviations from “tradition”. And it’d be even more
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This is how it always begins. But cheers to him wherever he ends up.
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The misadventures of Untold Stepchildren attempting to convince Thomists it's ok to believe embryos are human beings.
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23 days
Unbelievably fascinating. Plotinus's critique of Aristotelian Soul as Form. Actual gold if you happen to be studying the debates surrounding the Council of Vienne.
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2 months
Gotta be worth sharing at least once a day
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5 months
@MahanEsfahani Ordinarily I’d just add this to my “People Being Confidently Wrong” album and call it a day. But the level of stupidity here is uniquely unfathomable and unforgivable. The woman literally added a parenthetical to call further attention to the dumb.
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18 days
To anyone who might’ve been interested, @ErickYbarra3 and I decided we’re going to reschedule our debate. Hes got a decent bit on his platter and a possible conflict. I’ll let you know when we confirm a future date.
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1 month
Today, I share one of the greatest mysteries of history that I have- nevertheless- cracked in its entirety. It is the tale of a man so holy that he was martyr'd twice. A pope so formidable as to have been antipope, pope, and "chorepiscopus" in a single lifetime. A Christian so
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2 months
Maybe the Thomists were always just the Calvinists we met along the way.
@DrScotMSullivan
Dr. Scott M. Sullivan
@DrScotMSullivan
2 months
Thomistic Predestination 101: On the Thomistic theory of predestination, everyone falls into one of two groups: Group 1: The Predestined. These guys are the lucky ones. God loves this group the most, via His consequent will. To these folks God sends efficacious grace (without
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@al0bar_ How do atheists explain the fact the fact that sugar tastes good and thus life isnt an utterly miserable abyss of nothingness devoid of all pleasure and sense.
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WINNING. Its actually very cool to see this now that I’m in a position to understand how much Trinitarian theology is at stake in collapsing classical distinctions with the Filioque. This is superb for Christianity.
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@orthodox_times
Orthodox Times
@orthodox_times
1 month
The Lutheran World Federation (LWF) and the Orthodox Church have issued a joint statement on the addition of the Filioque clause to the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed #orthodox_times
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"Organic Liturgical Development"
@a_westgate
A. Westgate
@a_westgate
2 months
Sick BMX bike tricks during New World Order circus mass
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A Prayer to the Trinity by Dionysius the Areopagite Most exalted Trinity, divinity above all knowledge, whose goodness passes understanding, who guides Christians to divine wisdom; direct our way to the summit of your mystical oracles, most incomprehensible, most lucid and
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Completely and utterly astounding. In the singular spot in all of his work where Thomas gets Plato substantially correct, he makes the most significant of all concessions. And then he smuggles Plato's very position into his own conclusion. Why? Despite dismissing Plato's
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@redeemed_zoomer Come into the light, Zoomer! Let the Patristic Axiom be your guide to all truth!
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@suzania The headline is SOOO misleading, goodness. Firstly, there was an increase of 2% mortality rate across the board, meaning Texas diverged by only 6%. Secondly, birth defects alone account for ~25% of the excess deaths. Which means this study is actually revealing how frequently
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@ErickYbarra3 Surprised you sank to the low of posting this seriously. It doesnt take much to acknowledge Patristics distinguished between the Son and the Spirit in manifold ways, and that the East undeniably so quite frequently in one particular well explained by Gregory of Nyssa and
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4 months
@KolHue @silentpenitent @revhowardarson I agree with the sentiment but its also obvious Jews were being slaughtered by occupants of the region long before the state of Israel was established. The fact the power dynamic switched thereafter doesn’t change obvious (and explicit) desires the state not exist at all.
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1 month
The first clip attached is a direct quotation from the Catholic encyclopedia. Consider for just a moment how damning it is on the other matters I have included thereafter.
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I thought looking through medieval penitentials would be the most boring part of my research. I was wrong. From a 7th century pentitential of the Archbishop of Canterbury: -There were cases of people being remarried 5 (!) times -I'm not translating #15 for you, but it is
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
Exactly correct. It is quite frequently suggested Pope Honorius was condemned posthumously for mere "negligence of office," not heresy. But this is demonstrably false on any sensible reading of both the historical facts and council acts themselves. Honorius was, indeed,
@Galadhrin1
Galadhrin
@Galadhrin1
2 months
Pope Vigilius ratified Constantinople 553, and in his Second Constitutum likewise anathematized Theodore of Mopsuestia - posthumously. (See below) Pope Gregory the Dialogist (the Great), in his Synodical Letter (Book 1, Letter 25) to the other four patriarchs, confirmed all the
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
1 month
I knew about half of these, but seeing them all side by side is so extraordinary that you really cant help but laugh.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
3 months
@TimothyDEasley I ain’t gonna prove Theotokos today, of course. But I’ll suggest there’s another reading for this passage: “She is indeed blessed, but not merely because she is a biological mother. Rather, she is blessed for being a model of faith and obedience.”
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
My new motivation for getting to heaven: meeting and chilling out with one Sylvester Syropoulos. Sometimes somebody's just gotta say what needs to be said. When Mark of Ephesus took a water break, Sylvester Syropoulos was there for him.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
@Scholastic_X @CatholicDwong Also, why do you guys permit Eastern Rite Catholics to say the Creed without the Filioque? If they believe it, why wouldnt they say it? And if they dont believe it, then why arent you presently in union with heresy?
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
1 month
Reminder: don't let Catholics take away YOUR scripture! John 15:26 was the basis of the Nicene Creed's articulation of the procession of the Spirit and the very ground from which its vocabulary was drawn in the first. Support the movement to keep John 15:26 in your Bible!
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@cjohnsonn0311
ℂ𝕙𝕒𝕕 𝕁𝕠𝕙𝕟𝕤𝕠𝕟 🎚️
@cjohnsonn0311
1 month
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
4 months
@DanielR0senberg @jmhorp @MarketUrbanism ^^^this is exactly right and extremely important. Men tend to commit suicide about 4 times as often as women last I checked. Partly because men tend to use the sort of lethal force that rarely fails.
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
18 days
This raises far too many questions about what doctrine and dogma means to take seriously prima facie. However, its remarkable to me such a conservative scholar maintained this position, and also that the Chieti document and the subsequent Theological Commission documents clearly
@DrScotMSullivan
Dr. Scott M. Sullivan
@DrScotMSullivan
18 days
Minimal Catholicism: Cardinal Ratzinger thinks that all that is required for an Orthodox to be in communion with Rome is to accept a “minimal Catholicism” meaning two things: 1. Believe no more than what was demanded of a Christian living in the first millennium 2. The Orthodox
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
A few historical resources pertaining to: (a) The Deposition of Pope Vigilius (b) The Condemnation of Pope Honorius (c) The Deposition of Pope Liberius (d) The Recension of the Second Council of Lyons Decree (e) Mark of Ephesus's badassery at the Council of Florence (f) A
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
@ReasonTheology Uhhh, have ever you read the Saint and Doctor of your Church, Robert Bellarmine? He provides more than a few examples of popes being deposed against their will on suspicion of heresy. In a few of those cases, one or two men who spoke loudly against the pope in question were
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Untold Fortune
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3 months
@orapronobisdeum Can confirm. Was the 4th secret of fatima.
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
25 days
Why *did* this change? I'm genuinely curious. Because finishing the sign of the cross and returning to rest over your heart just feels undeniably apostolic. And our hearts are on the left side of our chests, right? So going right to left for the sign of the cross is obviously
@Orthodox_Xian
Kenneth
@Orthodox_Xian
25 days
According to Roman Catholic theologians ancient Christian’s crossed themselves right shoulder to left Pope Innocent III (13th century) said this was the correct manner Then it changed in the West (left to right) & nobody knows why Should Christians do it the ancient way?
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
25 days
For too long, Christianity has been oppressed with unilateral and unrelenting versification. Did our ancestors justify the pollution of their sacred texts with the most profane of conveniences? Are our scriptures reducible to a dewey decimal system? Did the *Patristics* have a
@Real_Rye_Bread
Solid Kvas🔥
@Real_Rye_Bread
25 days
Pretty based NewRomePress sells a bible without verses Versification is a great example of a convenient western innovation that churches adopted as a whole but is definitely not part of it and is not strictly neutral and thus may hurt our traditional more antique understanding
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
@USCatholic @HeidiSchlumpf There are many, many substantial criticisms of Thomism to be made, and ex-Thomists such as myself know this more than most. To Thomas’s credit, he was a highly synthetic thinker that wasn’t afraid to appeal to any and all resources of his era. But this aside, his citations of the
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
18 days
A rare case wherein I'll defend the otherwise blasphemous disciple of Aristotle. Ratzinger was a damn smart guy and- in my view- thoroughly committed to Christ. I have some (conspiracy) theories about his abdication, most of which involve a recognition that he didnt consider
@FeserEdward
Edward Feser
@FeserEdward
18 days
I acknowledged Benedict was “flawed” simply to try to pre-empt remarks from his critics (“But he resigned!” “But his theology was too modern!” etc.) that would be irrelevant to the point I was making. And I immediately went on to praise him as learned, good, and holy. Yet some
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
18 days
Indeed, I am going to be consistent in condemning both Putin and the Pope if and when they kiss the Qu'ran. The difference is that - while Putin doesnt represent my faith- the pope does represent that of Catholcs. Eminently so.
@btbsoco
BobTheBuilder
@btbsoco
18 days
Russian Orthodox, you slam the pope for doing this! (rightly) ...so are you going to be consistent; or make your excuses - because of your cult of Putin! (A man with Christian blood on his hands).
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
1 month
So Im sharing these passages from Gregory of Nyssa again because it hit me just how interesting and unique his way of looking at this question is and how easy it is to misunderstand it. At first glance, it *sounds* like he's saying unbaptized infants go to what you would
@archisoteric
Byzarchi☦︎ec☦︎
@archisoteric
3 months
I love St. Gregory Nyssa for a myriad reasons. His work 'On Infants Early Deaths' is an beautiful example of his eloquent prose in the face of a delicate subject. Here are some large excerpts...
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
3 months
@TDisputations Thomists rather problematically denied embryos had a *human* soul for the first 40 days. And this was not a fact of faulty biological understanding. They would believe it even today from their metaphysics re: rational powers cannot inhere before- at minimum- the biological organs
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
3 months
@therealdangb I mean if they actually accepted 879 Constantinople as they insinuate, they’d have to ditch the filioque. But then I think they literally defined it doctrinally? But they could also just call it a robber council. If they just trade out Florence for 879 Constantinople, filioque
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
1 month
Just another simple, leisurely read glorifying the wonders of Thomistic theology.
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
@HenryKing8859 Yes, that is exactly what they will claim. But you know what IS a forgery? At least FOUR different Patristic sources Thomas in Q. 36. No joke. His florigelium was just unbelievable.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
After an eastern rite Catholic's recent flippancy, I just had to investigate what he was talking about re: Jacobite Decree. As it turns out, its exactly as he described. "Florence sucked" is like the understatement of the Millenium.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
2 months
We want to ensure we get Thomists of the highest quality, not the half-hearted sort. In my charity, I've put together a Thomist starter kit you can use to test whether they're the real deal or not.
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@AngloVarangian
Anglo Varangian
@AngloVarangian
2 months
As usual the WR advocates are backtracking now, but everyone has already seen multiple statements of them advocating for thomism and the WR blogsite doing the same
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
5 months
@AChillGhost Unless, of course, you learned both Latin and Greek from the Jesuits. You may or may not end up with utterly strange, syncretic theology. But you will know your classical languages like riding a bike.
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@UntoldFortune
Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
28 days
An excerpt from John Chrysostom's Exegesis of Matthew, Homily 62. Notably: the unbaptized children of Galilee.
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Untold Fortune
@UntoldFortune
1 month
@AllSouls00 That a Catholic might accept that scenario begrudgingly is one thing. But to embrace and glorify it as you seem to suggest is beyond my understanding.
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